Kanto Elite
Posts: 35
Shipping Allegiance: Pearlshipping
Badass Punchline: You have self-awareness or you have nothing.
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Post by coatatopotato on Mar 10, 2022 15:08:28 GMT
"Victory lap" was exactly the word I was looking for. Indeed, I think recently they may have just abandoned the plan on seeing the negative reactions to Goh as a character. It all feels very haphazard.
Although I can still hope for the stereotypical walking-into-the-sunset ending for Ash and Dawn. If they had to remove Ash, that'd be the way I hope it's done.
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Post by JohtoFesta on Mar 11, 2022 2:46:09 GMT
coatatopotatoI felt that way about the Amour moments too - like the writers were trolling Serena. And then they played up the dance episode, and she just missed getting to dance with Ash. Anyway, it’ll be interesting watching how the writers handle her return.
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Kanto Elite
Posts: 35
Shipping Allegiance: Pearlshipping
Badass Punchline: You have self-awareness or you have nothing.
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Post by coatatopotato on Mar 11, 2022 13:10:17 GMT
I felt that way about the Amour moments too - like the writers were trolling Serena. And then they played up the dance episode, and she just missed getting to dance with Ash. That does seem to be the theme with all of Ash's traveling companions. I vaguely recall the same thing happening with Dawn way back when.
The big question on Serena's return, more than any other character, is not when she will return, but if. She's the most difficult to write the return for, in my opinion.
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Post by JohtoFesta on Mar 11, 2022 19:57:28 GMT
coatatopotatoI’m not really sure what you’re talking about. “All” of his companions? I mean, Misty danced with Ash. Dawn did not want to dance with Ash, nor did she have a crush. In any case, the trolling was way more apparent in Serena’s case because she had an undeniable, canon crush. I even remember the writers having to apologize to the Amour community for the title of the ‘date’ episode being so misleading, lol.
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Kanto Elite
Posts: 35
Shipping Allegiance: Pearlshipping
Badass Punchline: You have self-awareness or you have nothing.
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Post by coatatopotato on Mar 12, 2022 13:20:20 GMT
Sorry JohtoFesta my memory has admittedly faded in the many years since these episodes.  Looking it up, what I seemed to be (mis)remembering was one time that Ash asked to dance with Dawn. Dancing, in general, has been a motif with various people is what I'm getting at. And Misty apart, they're usually interrupted before they actually dance.
I would think asserting Dawn "did not" have a crush on Ash would be heresy around these parts.  That said, I do get your point about it being in contention.
Of course, how much of it is trolling Serena versus just taking commercial advantage of the ship is debatable. I would argue there's not really much of a difference. (But yeah, that "date" was weak sauce).
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Post by JohtoFesta on Mar 13, 2022 7:42:51 GMT
coatatopotatoAh, I see. Yeah, trolling Serena = trolling Amourshippers, lol. Sorry, I'm just of the opinion we shouldn't delude ourselves into not being able to acknowledge the reality of the anime (as a lot of shippers do, and it's aggravating and only makes us look childish and emotionally immature). I don't normally ship tho - I'm usually a non-shipper and don't always agree with the shipper's mindset. I of course like to imagine Ash and Dawn have unrealized crushes on each other. But that's still in a sort of AU where Ash isn't, of course, aromantic. And I like to play devil's advocate in an argument to test the strength of the ship compared to others...if that makes sense.
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Kanto Elite
Posts: 35
Shipping Allegiance: Pearlshipping
Badass Punchline: You have self-awareness or you have nothing.
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Post by coatatopotato on Mar 13, 2022 14:13:35 GMT
JohtoFesta Yes, I agree that there's not much evidence in canon to make the assumption. Ash is about as clueless as I was at his age. I will say though, if you had to pick someone Ash liked, Dawn would be a decent choice.
To be clear, the shipping view is not my position, it was just a tongue-in-cheek comment about the forum.
Actually, what happened here is I was devil's advocate-ing against you as well, for the same reasons you provided. So it was like a double devil's advocate where neither of us ended up defending our real positions... and I ended up with a headache.  |
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Post by IceArceus on Mar 13, 2022 19:06:48 GMT
I would think asserting Dawn "did not" have a crush on Ash would be heresy around these parts.  That said, I do get your point about it being in contention. It's interesting that you say that cause before I WOULD have said Dawn had a crush on Ash, I think, but these days I would say neither of them had a crush on each other, but then again I don't know if my position has actually shifted, or if I was only really worked up before about them being a good pair together as opposed to them having actual crushes on each other. Ahhh! Probably my position has shifted. It's been like 9 years. There are a lot of things I would do differently now if I was starting a forum. Sorry, I'm just of the opinion we shouldn't delude ourselves into not being able to acknowledge the reality of the anime (as a lot of shippers do, and it's aggravating and only makes us look childish and emotionally immature). Very much agree with this. |
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That said, I do get your point about it being in contention.
That said, I do get your point about it being in contention.
need a break from that. I cannot express how much more I appreciate fan-translations of anything now